testimony and testimony given by me at any previous time which is brought to my attention, I ask the privilege of correcting the record to show the exact state of facts to the best of my recollection. Mr. BAUMAN. Major Barrett, you were served a subpena duces tecum of this committee calling upon you to produce your canceled checks, bank statements and check stubs. Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. Do you have those books? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir; I have everything I have. Mr. BAUMAN. Major Barrett, when were you appointed Major and Superintendent of Police? Mr. BARRETT. July 1, 1947. Mr. BAUMAN. About July 24, 1947, the Washington Post quoted you as saying [reading]: As the new police chief I want to make it clear at the start that gambling and prostitution will not be tolerated in this city. Did you make that statement, sir? Mr. BARRETT. I don't recall. Mr. BAUMAN. Do you have any recollection of having made that pronouncement? Mr. BARRETT. There are so many things in the Washington Post that it would be impossible for me to remember. Mr. BAUMAN. Well, you did, upon your appointment Mr. BARRETT. Many articles-there was a campaign started against me 2 days before I was appointed that continued from then on until today. Mr. BAUMAN. Well, did you want to make it clear, Major, that you would not tolerate gambling and prostitution in this city? Mr. BARRETT. I don't recall just the statement-as I said before, I don't have any files-but I did make a statement to that effect. Mr. BAUMAN. What were the general conditions in Washington in July 1947 when you became Major and Superintendent? Mr. BARRETT. The gambling conditions in Washington are down to a minimum now, and I did everything that I possibly could as Chief of Police, starting July 1, 1947, to combat them. Mr. BAUMAN. What were those conditions at that time, sir? Mr. BAUMAN. If you were asked to describe the situation as respects numbers in the District of Columbia and bookmaking in the District of Columbia, was it widespread, was it rampant, was it organized? Mr. BARRETT. There were numbers-there was another name. They called it "policy." When I was appointed a policeman in 1925, and later on, I believe 1928 or as I recall 1927 or 1928, they changed the name of its from "policy slips"-from "policy" to "numbers." Mr. BAUMAN. Was that a large enterprise in July 1947 in your opinion, Major? Mr. BARRETT. Well, there have been many different ones active in the numbers business, yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. And among those who were active in the numbers business at the time you took office on July 1, 1947, who would you say would be the biggest operator in the District of Columbia? Mr. BARRETT. I don't have any idea who would be the bigger. I want to make this clear right from the start. You are talking about the District of Columbia. The numbers are picked up by pickup men in the District of Columbia but the headquarters for the number players were either in Maryland or Virginia. Mr. BAUMAN. I have that in mind. I am aware that in some instances that may be true and I have it in mind. Mr. BARRETT. I don't know of one-I cannot think of one at the time I don't know of one that had headquarters in the District of Columbia. Mr. BAUMAN. Did you ever hear of a man named Roger Simkins? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. What is his business or occupation to the best of your knowledge, Major? Mr. BARRETT. Well, the best of my knowledge is that he is a gambler. Mr. BAUMAN. And you would say Mr. BARRETT. And he runs a restaurant. Mr. BAUMAN. Would you say he is a big numbers gambler? Mr. BARRETT. I don't know how big he is. My information is that he is a numbers operator. Mr. BAUMAN. Well, sır, you are aware of the difference between the man who stands on the street and writes numbers and the backer to whom he turns them in. Would you say that Roger Simkins was a numbers backer? Mr. BARRETT. Only by reputation. Mr. BAUMAN. How about Emmitt Warring, what is his business or occupation? Mr. BARRETT. Same thing. Mr. BAUMAN. How about Sam Beard? Mr. BARRETT. Sam Beard was a numbers gambler. Mr. BAUMAN (after pause). Have you finished your answer, sir? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. Have you heard of a man named Abe Plisco, known as Jew Boy Dietz? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. What is his occupation or business? Mr. BARRETT. He has a reputation for the same thing, being a gambler and my understanding is that he has a business in Washington, flower business. Mr. BAUMAN. Would you say that Charles E. Nelson, Snags Lewis, Robert L. Nowland, Shep Shapiro Mr. BARRETT. He is dead. Mr. BAUMAN. Yes, I know that. He lived, I believe, the first 2 years of your appointment-and Puddinhead Jones-are those names familiar to you? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. Are they big numbers operators or gamblers in the District of Columbia who solicit numbers taken in the District of Columbia? Mr. BARRETT. Well, that is my information, that information has been brought to me personally. I don't know of any of them that I have ever seen violating the law, but that is the information, that they are. Mr. BAUMAN. How about Garry Quinn, is that name familiar to you? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. What is his business or occupation? Mr. BARRETT. He runs a club and he had the reputation of being a gambler at one time. Mr. BAUMAN. Now, we are agreed, are we not, Major, that we are not talking about any small-time operators, is that correct? These men all had the reputation of being big gamblers in the District of Columbia? Mr. BARRETT. Well, you were talking about Puddinhead Jones, and I would like to make it very clear that there have been articles in the newspaper and so forth about him being big. That is not true; that is not true. He has been-he is a colored man, he has a grocery store and personally I would say that he is a small operator. He has been very friendly and very helpful to the police. Mr. BAUMAN, With that one exception though you would agree that the other ones mentioned could be, in police parlance, classified as big operators, isn't that correct? Mr. BARRETT. They were-some of them have and some of them are out of it. Mr. BAUMAN. Do you think that gambling of this kind and on this scale is a serious problem in the District of Columbia? Mr. BARRETT. Sure. Mr. BAUMAN. And that numbers gambling is a form of organized crime? Mr. BARRETT. Well, it is organized within their own outfit. It is not one group. There has never been anything in Washington here that was organized, there has never been an organized group coming here to do anything that wasn't arrested. Mr. BAUMAN. What you mean, I assume, is that within each organization there is organization. But you are saying that the names I have read to the best of your knowledge are not formed into one syndicate, is that what you mean? Mr. BARRETT. That is correct. Anybody can start in the numbers business. I know of a particular case where a prisoner was released from Lorton. Two of his friends that had been in Lorton had been out before him, they knew of the date he was to be released and waited for him and that afternoon they started in the numbers business. Mr. BAUMAN. You retired, I believe, in October, is that right? Mr. BARRETT. November 30. Mr. BAUMAN. November 30, I beg your pardon. Senator PASTORE. What year? Mr. BAUMAN. Of 1951, is that correct? Mr. BARRETT. Yes, sir. Mr. BAUMAN. What would you estimate would be the weekly gross played on policy numbers in the District of Columbia for the first 11 months of 1951? Mr. BARRETT. I have no idea. Mr. BAUMAN. Have you ever made any inquiries as to what that might be? Mr. BARRETT. Others have. The grand juries and so forth have conducted investigations. We had a special grand jury here that had an investigation for 18 months, and there is another one in session right now. Mr. BAUMAN. What did you do, sir? Mr. BARRETT. What did Mr. BAUMAN. What did you do to determine the size, the area and the scope of this racket in the District of Columbia? Mr. BARRETT. I had orders issued that every policeman on the force has an oath to do his duty, from the private to my own self, when I was superintendent, and there were orders for them to report suspected places immediately and take proper action, and that was done. Mr. BAUMAN. Would you say that that was substantially all the action you had taken in connection with the enforcement of the numbers gambling law in the District? Mr. BARRETT. I did everything I possibly could and I feel the Police Department did. Mr. BAUMAN. Did you not feel it a matter of vital importance to look into a racket the existence of which in this city is supposed to involve a gross figure of $100 million a year? Mr. BARRETT. That is hearsay. Mr. BAUMAN. What do you think it was, sir? Mr. BARRETT. I don't know. Mr. BAUMAN. Did you ever make any effort to find out? Mr. BARRETT. Only what I heard at the grand jury and statements released to the press. Mr. BAUMAN. Did you ever consult with the United States Attorney? Mr. BARRETT. Many times. Mr. BAUMAN. In an effort to break up this racket at its source? Mr. BAUMAN. What was your recommendation in that connection? Mr. BARRETT. I had went to Mr. Fay at one particular time and in fact before I sent my man, Lieutenant, Inspector Blick, over toover to see Mr. Fay about the number of cases that the grand juries were ignoring and that was either in April or May 1948. Inspector Blick was taken before a grand jury and this grand jury he was taken before only had 3 days left. Immediately after that one went out, he was taken before another grand jury and he outlined to them and told them the difficulties that we were up against, and there were different articles as to why we were not getting the big man-that was the gist of most of the stories. Mr. BAUMAN. So that Mr. BARRETT. He explained to them that the big man did not operate in the District, that he had headquarters in Maryland and Virginia. You could see an increase in indictments from then on. The next thing, shortly after that, was the early part of May, I think it was May 10, my mother at that time had died, was laid out and I got a call that Mr. Fay had petitioned Judge Laws for a special grand jury to go into gambling in the District of Columbia and nearby areas, which he did, which resulted in one or two raids here in the District of Columbia after 18 months and several arrests in Maryland. Mr. BAUMAN. What specific efforts did you make to place any man within the top organization of the numbers ring, such as that allegedly run by Emmitt Warring and Roger Simkins or any of the other big numbers men I mentioned? Mr. BARRETT. What was that? Mr. BAUMAN. Do you want it repeated? Mr. BAUMAN. What specific efforts did you make to place one of your men within the organization of any big numbers operators so that instead of arresting the man on the street you could have in fact gotten the big shot at the top? Is the question clear, sir? Mr. BARRETT. It is impossible to place a man in any numbers man's operation. They would not deal with a man they hadn't practically known all their lives. Mr. BAUMAN. Did you ever try it? Mr. BARRETT. I personally did not but I know that the vice squad made every effort possible; we did everything that was possible. I gave authority to all commanding officers to use any men, any effort. The captains were issued an order in 1949, and after a meeting with all my inspectors and officials-I had the inspectors draw up a new gambling order and sent it out to the force, that they were to put the responsibility on the man on the beat, the corporal, the sergeant made them put the official in charge of the precinct in charge of gambling, most of all the captain, he was held responsibile, and on up the line Mr. BAUMAN. Well, aren't you familiar with the fact that in similar and perhaps more difficult situations other law enforcement agencies such as the Federal Bureau of Investigation have succeeded in putting their operatives within organizations, within illegal enterprises, for the purpose of destroying them-isn't that right? Mr. BARRETT. That is very true. Mr. BAUMAN. Now, Major Mr. BARRETT. We have had policemen, we have had policemen, rookie policemen that I have never seen, the minute they take the oath-sometimes they didn't take the oath at police headquarters, they took it in other places so that they would not be shown or known, they were put in different spots. And I remember on one occasion that we had one in the Brass Rail, in Simkins' place that worked as a dishwasher for 2 or 3 weeks. Mr. BAUMAN. You would admit that an attempt to apprehend any major numbers criminal would have required a great deal of planning and cooperation at the top level, is that right? Mr. BARRETT. We had it. Mr. BAUMAN. What specific efforts, specific efforts have you made. to apprehend Emmitt Warring or any other big numbers man? Mr. BARRETT. We have made every effort possible and for the past 3 years, I want to make it plain, Emmitt Warring has been investigated and under indictment I believe-investigated by the Internal Revenue, and men tailed him, and my information was that he spent most of his time around the courthouse, to be seen. Mr. BAUMAN. Well, the numbers operation, Major, involves pretty much, it involves adding machines, it involves having 15 or 20 adding machine operators, it is a business transaction-why didn't you put somebody in those offices to get evidence to convict Emmitt Warring of the numbers racket? Mr. BARRETT. We used every undercover man it was possible to ́use and I gave authority to the vice squad, to the captains of the precincts, to use every man, to use as many as possible, even to trade A captain in No. 1, if he knew a man in No. 4 who could make an arrest or get evidence in another precinct, he could do it without men. |