supplemental lighting he talks about, and be able to reach the same result? Mr. SEIBERLING. I am sure they could accommodate us, Mr. Chairman, and this amendment will put them in the position where they will. The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the amendment offered by the gentleman from Ohio. All those in favor of the adoption of the amendment, please say aye. [Chorus of "ayes."] The CHAIRMAN. All those opposed? [Chorus of "noes."] The CHAIRMAN. The noes have it. Mr. SEIBERLING. Rollcall, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. A call of the roll is demanded and the clerk will call the roll. All those in favor please say aye, all those opposed, no. Mr. RANGEL. Mr. Chairman, don't you need a certain number of people to have a rollcall? The CHAIRMAN. I don't think that there hasn't been that certain number of people since we have been demanding rollcalls. The clerk will call the roll. The CLERK. Mr. Donohue. Mr. DONOHUE. NO. The CLERK. Mr. Brooks. Mr. BROOKS. No. The CLERK. Mr. Kastenmeier. [No response.] The CLERK, Mr. Edwards. Mr. EDWARDS. No. The CLERK. Mr. Hungate. Mr. HUNGATE. No. The CLERK. Mr. Conyers. The CLERK. Mr. Eilberg. The CLERK. Mr. Waldie. Mr. WALDIE. No. The CLERK. Mr. Flowers. Mr. FLOWERS. No. The CLERK. Mr. Mann. The CLERK, Mr. Sarbanes. Mr. SARBANES. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Seiberling. Mr. DRINAN. No. The CLERK, Mr. Rangel. Mr. RANGEL. No. The CLERK, Ms. Jordan. Ms. JORDAN. No. The CLERK. Mr. Thornton. Mr. THORNTON. No. The CLERK. Mr. Owens. The CLERK. Mr. Mezvinsky. The CLERK. Mr. Hutchinson. The CLERK. Mr. Smith. Mr. SMITH. No. The CLERK. Mr. Sandman. Mr. SANDMAN. NO. The CLERK. Mr. Railsback. The CLERK. Mr. Dennis. Mr. DENNIS. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Fish. The CLERK. Mr. Mayne. The CLERK. Mr. Hogan. The CLERK. Mr. Butler. Mr. BUTLER. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Cohen. Mr. COHEN. No. The CLERK. Mr. Lott. Mr. Lort. No. The CLERK. Mr. Froehlich. Mr. FROEHLICH. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Moorhead. Mr. MOORHEAD. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Maraziti. Mr. MARAZITI. No. The CLERK. Mr. Latta. [No response.] The CLERK. Mr. Rodino. The CHAIRMAN. No. Mr. KASTENMEIER. Mr. Chairman? The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Kastenmeier. Mr. KASTENMEIER. I wish to be recorded as no. The CHAIRMAN. The clerk will kindly report Mr. Kastenmeier. Has the clerk reported Mr. Kastenmeier voting no? no. The CLERK. Mr. Kastenmeier is recorded as voting no. Mr. Chairman, 8 members have voted aye, 29 members have voted The CHAIRMAN. And the amendment is not agreed to. Mr. McCLORY. Mr. Chairman, I move the previous question. The CHAIRMAN. The question occurs on the motion offered by the gentleman from Utah. All those in favor please say aye. [Chorus of "ayes."] The CHAIRMAN. All those opposed? The CHAIRMAN. The ayes have it and—————— The CHAIRMAN. The motion is agreed to. Mr. DENNIS. Get a rollcall on that. The CHAIRMAN. The clerk will call the roll. All those in favor of the motion please signify by saying aye. All those opposed, no. The CLERK. Mr. Donohue. Mr. DONOHUE. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Brooks. Mr. BROOKS. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Kastenmeier. Mr. KASTEN MEIER. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Edwards. The CLERK. Mr. Flowers. Mr. FLOWERS. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Mann. The CLERK. Mr. Sarbanes. Mr. SARBANES. No. The CLERK. Mr. Seiberling. The CLERK. Mr. Danielson. Mr. DRINAN. No. The CLERK. Mr. Rangel. Mr. RANGEL. Aye. Ms. JORDAN. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Thornton. Mr. THORNTON. Aye. The CLERK. Ms. Holtzman. Ms. HOLTZMAN. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Owens. Mr. OWENS. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Mezvinsky. Mr. MEZVINSKY. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Hutchinson. Mr. DENNIS. No by proxy. The CLERK. Mr. McClory. The CLERK. Mr. Sandman. The CLERK. Mr. Railsback. The CLERK. Mr. Dennis. Mr. DENNIS. No. The CLERK. Mr. Fish. The CLERK. Mr. Mayne. The CLERK. Mr. Butler. The CLERK. Mr. Cohen. Mr. COHEN. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Lott. Mr. LOTT. No. The CLERK. Mr. Froehlich. Mr. FROEHLICH. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Moorhead. Mr. MOORHEAD. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Maraziti. Mr. MARAZITI. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Latta. Mr. LATTA. Aye. The CLERK. Mr. Rodino. The CHAIRMAN. Aye. Before the clerk records the results, Mr. Sarbanes. Mr. SARBANES. I want to change my vote to aye. The CLERK. Mr. Sarbanes changes his vote to aye. Mr. Chairman, 31 members have voted aye, 7 members have voted no. The CHAIRMAN. The motion is agreed to. The Chair will recess this meeting at this time to hear Mr. Garrison for the rest of his presentation, and the Chair will advise the rest of the public that this is a closed briefing session. The meeting is recessed until the call of the Chair. [Whereupon, at 4:58 p.m., the committee was recessed subject to the call of the Chair.] IMPEACHMENT INQUIRY Executive Session MONDAY, JULY 22, 1974 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, The committee met, pursuant to recess, at 5:05 p.m., in room 2141, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Peter W. Rodino, Jr. (chairman) presiding. Present: Representatives Rodino (presiding), Donohue, Brooks, Kastenmeier, Edwards, Hungate, Conyers, Eilberg, Waldie, Flowers, Mann, Sarbanes, Seiberling, Danielson, Drinan, Rangel, Jordan, Thornton, Holtzman, Owens, Mezvinsky, McClory, Smith, Sandman, Railsback, Wiggins, Dennis, Fish, Mayne, Hogan, Butler, Cohen, Lott, Froehlich, Moorhead, Maraziti, and Latta. Impeachment inquiry staff present: John Doar, special counsel; Samuel Garrison III, special counsel to the minority; Albert E. Jenner, Jr., senior associate special counsel; Richard Cates, senior associate special counsel; Bernard W. Nussbaum, senior associate special counsel; Evan A. Davis, counsel; Richard H. Gill, counsel; Edward S. Szukelewicz, counsel, Ben A. Wallis, Jr., counsel. Committee staff present: Jerome M. Zeifman, general counsel; Garner J. Cline, associate general counsel; William P. Dixon, counsel; Michael W. Blommer, associate counsel; and Franklin G. Polk, associate counsel. The CHAIRMAN. The committee will please come to order. Mr. GARRISON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, ladies and gentlemen of the committee. When we recessed the hearing at noontime, I had been discussing the question of the President's statements during his conversation with John Dean on the morning of March 21, in terms of whether what the President said that morning can reasonably be construed and found by you as a fact to constitute his joining the conspiracy. Words are capable of being overt acts or conduct sufficient to satisfy the legal requirement of affirmative action, when accompanied by the requisite intent and knowledge. I think that I have discussed the question of what "knowledge" would mean, in the context of a matter being brought to the President's attention with some possibility of doubt in his mind as to the accuracy of all or part of what he was being told. I would like to focus now, though, on the question of whether the President did manifest approval or acquiescence in the making of the March 21 payment. I distinguish this point from the one I made previously, which was whether the President actually authorized and |