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Mr. LANZA. I am sorry-the Cuban debt to the Soviet Union. T..is $3 billion is due to the Soviet Union-the major part-and also to other countries. He also said, I believe, that the debt that Cuba has to the Soviet Union and to other nations is not much for weaponry but for other forms of aid, that the weapons that they got from the Soviet Union were in the nature of grants and gifts rather than anything else.

Mr. ZION. J. Edgar Hoover has charged that the Cuban delegation to the United Nations is a major center for espionage here in the United States. I wonder if Señor Suarez, of his own knowledge, could substantiate that.

Mr. LANZA. If Mr. Hoover says it, he must have good reasons for saying it. But I do not have personal knowledge of this.

Mr. ZION. And then one final question, please, sir: Since Fidel has now become indebted to many other nations, primarily to the Soviet Union, what sort of obligation do you think he has? What is he expected to do in exchange?

Mr. LANZA. It is a well-known fact that the Soviets never cancel their debts: they might postpone payment, but they are always going to be asking that some payment be made. But I don't think this is the type of debt that Cuba will ever be able to pay.

I am sure that within the next 10 years or even more there will be no changes in improving the Cuban economy.

Mr. ZION. My question was really to lead to whether or not they might be expected to have offensive Soviet weapons or provide ports for Soviet atomic submarines, et cetera.

Mr. LANZA. I believe that Cuba has to make some special concessions. I believe in the possibility and even the probability that will be the case. There have been other occasions in which Cuba has paid in that form for the aid that they have received. We could mention the case of the invasion of Czechoslovakia by Russian troops. There is an example in which Cuba praised the action taken by the Soviets. We could interpret that as a form of payment.

Mr. ZION. I thank the gentleman very much for his testimony. You have been very helpful, sir.

Mr. PEPPER. Mr. Schmitz.

Mr. SCHMITZ. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Suarez, for your testimony. I have a few questions here about Fidel Castro's early activities, and my questions basically revolve around when he became a communist. You said you met him in 1953 at the University of Havana, and you stated you were not a student at that time. Was Fidel Castro a student at that time, or why was he at the university?

Mr. LANZA. In 1953 the University of Havana was a center of unrest and political activity. It is well known that by then Fidel Castro already had some political aspirations. There was a lot of activity at the university. A lot of this activity was by the youth or the young men who were going to the university there, especially by one association called the FEU-the letters F-E-U. This means the "Association of University Students." Now, these people were very active in politics and also in political turmoil.

The truth is that he was interested in politics since the very beginning. I do believe he was a student at the university, and I do believe

that he attended classes. Also I know that in 1952 he ran for political office, which shows that he was interested in politics at that time.

Mr. SCHMITZ. When you met him in 1953, were you aware of his activities in Bogota, Colombia, in 1948?

Mr. LANZA. I was aware then and it was common knowledge-at least it was said that he had participated to an extent, which I do not know, in the 1948 events in Bogota, which started with the death of Dr. Guytan. However, I do not know, to this moment, what his actual participation was and whether it was of any importance.

Mr. SCHMITZ. Do you know that he was arrested at that time in Colombia?

Mr. LANZA. No, sir.

Mr. SCHMITZ. For the record, I believe he was arrested, along with a communist by the name of Rafael del Pino. Do you know Rafael del Pino?

Mr. LANZA. Sir, I do know del Pino; I know of him, and he is a relative of Fidel. I think he is Fidel's brother-in-law or some relative; I believe that there is some "in-law" relationship. But I would like to point out that I did not know that they had been arrested. As I understood it, they were there and they were allowed to leave Colombia.

Mr. SCHMITZ. The one I am referring to was a communist who was arrested in Bogota. He is today an American citizen held captive in Cuba. That is the one I am referring to. He married an American wife and took on American citizenship and went to Cuba and has been arrested, and for obvious reasons he is being kept there because he is quite familiar with Fidel Castro's early activities.

Mr. LANZA. Yes, sir; I am referring to the same person. This same person, as far as I know, was arrested when he landed in a small plane in Cuba. This is the person. It is known that he and Fidel were close when they were both very young.

Mr. SCHMITZ. One of Fidel Castro's brothers-in-law is named Rafael Diaz Balart, and you are not referring to him; is that right?

Mr. LANZA. No; Diaz Balart is another person. He is a person who participated in an uprising against Batista in the early days. This man is dead now, and I have a great respect for him.

Mr. SCHMITZ. Mr. Suarez, on page 6 of your testimony, you state: "However, as communism gained power, liberal and centrist members of the new Government lost influence." What year would you estimate that communism attained working power over the Cuban Government? Mr. LANZA. I would say that by the end of 1961 they acquired complete strength and complete domination; I mean they were in chargeafter the Bay of Pigs.

Mr. SCHMITZ. When did they have working control? Let me ask the question this way: If the communists took over for control purposes in 1962, why were they teaching courses in Marxism-Leninism in 1959 to the armed forces?

Mr. LANZA. Because as soon as the dependence on the Soviet Union started, these courses were instituted.

Mr. SCHMITZ. But at that time, they didn't have control of the government?

Mr. LANZA. During the first 6 months they had no control; they did have influence, especially in the armed forces.

Mr. SCHMITZ. In 1961, all civilian government officials and employees were required to take courses in Marxism-Leninism. Why did the

government, that was not yet under communist control, require that all civilian government officials and employees take Marxism-Leninism courses?

Mr. LANZA. Because there was control in the ideological part of the government; there was not control, until later, in the administrative part of the government.

Mr. SCHMITZ. What is the ideological part of the government?

Mr. LANZA. Amongst those persons who teach and to promote the doctrines of Marxist-Leninism which were being taught in Cuba. I will try to make it clearer. As to this ideological plan, the leader was Anevalez Calantay, a well-known communist. Now, in the army, there were some cadre where there was no communist influence yet-I mean there wasn't communist domination yet; in others there were.

Mr. SCHMITZ. To summarize, then-and I don't expect an answer unless you feel you want to answer-but I find if, on one hand, the communists did not take control of the government until 1962, I find it strange that they were requiring Marxism-Leninism courses for their government officials and employees in 1961 and giving courses in Marxism-Leninism in the armed forces in 1959.

The reason I asked this is because it leads to my next question. You say, "Through my personal knowledge of Fidel Castro I can state that he is a total opportunist interested only in power." In your personal knowledge, what actions of Fidel Castro distinguish him as an opportunist rather than a cryptocommunist who surfaces at a certain time, in the light of his activities in Bogota in 1948?

Mr. LANZA. The comment I will make-and this will surprise youis that I will say I truly don't believe Fidel Castro is a communist; he is a Fidelista: he is a man who does things for his own conveniences, for his own faith, his own personal one. He has changed many times. There were times in which he has operated with his colleagues that were with him at the beginning who were not communists. There were other times in which he acts only with communists. I would say this is the reason why I say he is an opportunist; he is not a man of principle, but a man who will take advantage of the situation. Mr. SCHMITZ. In other words, he doesn't think Fidel Castro is a communist today even?

Mr. LANZA. I was expressing this in a figurative sense. I was saying this in merely a figurative sense. He is not a communist in the traditional sense of a communist who is willing to submit himself to the disciplines of the communist party. He certainly does as he pleases to the extent that if I were going to define him I would have to define him as an anarchist. We must also remember that he is quite egocentric: he loves himself; he loves himself more than anything else. Mr. SCHMITZ. One last very quick question: Are you familiar with the exporting of military personnel to Portuguese Africa to aid in the revolution against Portugal?

Mr. LANZA. Yes, sir. I know something about it.

Mr. SCHMITZ. I don't want to take up time. Do you have any short comments on the exporting of military personnel?

Mr. LANZA. It is common to see in Cuba. Frequently you see persons, usually blacks-I am sorry-blacks who have been-w were veterans of actions that had taken place in Portuguese Guinea and also in the Congo.

Mr. SCHMITZ. Thank you.

Mr. PEPPER. Mr. Suarez, we wish very much to thank you for your valuable testimony and for your kindness in coming to testify before our committee today. We respect you for having defected from communism in Cuba and doing what you can in bringing to the awareness of the people of this country what communism means and what communism is doing in Cuba. Thank you very much.

Mr. LANZA. Thank you very much for your kindness, sir.

Mr. PEPPER. Thank you very much.

We have another witness, Mr. Gustavo B. Marin.

Will you be sworn, please, Mr. Marin. Do you solemnly swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

Mr. MARIN. I do.

TESTIMONY OF GUSTAVO B. MARIN

Mr. PEPPER. We are running a little late and we have important legislation on the floor. I wonder if it would be all right with you and counsel if we put your entire statement in the record for the benefit of the committee and that you then be invited to give a summary of your testimony in summary form and state what you would like to say to the committee today. Would that be all right with you? Mr. MARIN. Yes, sir.

Mr. PEPPER. Without objection, the entire statement of Mr. Gustavo B. Marin will appear in the record.

(Mr. Marin's biographical sketch and formal statement follows:)

AGRUPACION ESTUDIANTIE ABDALA

(P.O. Box 595, Corona Elmhurst Station, N.Y.)

GUSTAVO B. MARIN

Personal Reference

OCTOBER 2, 1971.

Born: March 22, 1947 in Havana, Cuba.

Cuban citizen. Came to the United States as an exile August 12, 1961.

Graduated from St. Francis College, New York City, 1970, B.A. in Latin American Studies.

Now completing studies toward M.A. in Spanish literature at Hunter College of the City of New York.

Teacher of social studies and languages at a local high school.

Active participant in Cuban anti-Castro groups. Concluded, after such participation, that Cuba's liberation could only be achieved through a massive effort by Cuban youth in exile-a generation committed to the present and future destiny of our Nation.

One of the original members of Spanish-speaking Y.C.S. (Young Christian Students), 1964, which worked among Spanish-speaking minority groups and in social action programs.

Founder of the ABDALA Student Movement, January 28, 1968. President of that organization.

Was one of the 16 members of ABDALA who chained themselves at U.N. Security Council chamber, during protest on behalf of 40,000 Cuban political prisoners. Was arrested as a result. (March 13, 1971).

Active organizer of student confrontations with the Venceremos Brigade in the United States.

ABDALA

On January 28, 1968, a number of Cuban students in the United States came together and founded what started as study group with the only purposeostensibly-of keeping informed on everything revelant to the present situation of our country. We thus hoped to maintain the national spirit alive among young Cuban exiles. But almost immediately the motive expanded to the unification of a stateless but not rootless, fighting generation-with Cuba's liberation from Soviet totalitarianism as our goal, and a free Cuban government based on democracy, social justice and the self-determination of the Cuban people as our aim.

Young, committed only to the task of freedom for our enslaved nation and a Cuban future that we hope to make better, we named the new movement after our José Martí's youthful epic hero: ABDALA.

OPERATIONS

We now have more than 500 active members operating from chapters throughout the East and Midwest in the United States, as well as in Latin America and Spain-coordinated by a National Directorate.

As of our First National Congress, ABDALA's ranks have expanded to include a young workers' division and an Institute of Cuban Studies (Instituto de Capacitación y Estudios Cubanos ABDALA, I. C. E. C. A.) with the cooperation and direct involvement of established exiled Cuban intellectuals: writers, professionals and university professors.

ABDALA currently publishes its own monthly newspaper, with contributed articles from I. C. E. C. A.'s activists, which has 10,000 circulation in the United States and abroad, including Cuba.

ACTIVITIES OF CUBAN AND LATIN AMERICAN COMMUNISTS ON CAMPUS-WHAT ABDALA

FACES

The Venceremos Brigade

Their present activities, as we see them.

Our chapter at State University of Illinois at Champaign reports that the Venceremos Brigade conducts recruitment of students and professors on campus. One exiled Cuban professor teaching at Champaign was invited to visit Cuba and declined the invitation.

From our members' personal observation, Venceremos Brigade recruiting officers are now giving preference to students of Oriental extraction.

Alleged dissenters within Venceremos Brigade remain silent-reasons unknown-upon return to the United States.

One incident reported in the Midwest where Venceremos Brigade members attempted to speak to an elementary school class.

Explosive weapons seized by police in Brookline, Mass., resulting in the arrest of four people, two of them closely affiliated to the Venceremos Brigade (Boston Globe, Boston Herald, September 17, 1971). Several Cuban military medals were found among material confiscated by police. The two Venceremos Brigade members involved in the incident flew to Cuba from Mexico; their return to the United States through Canada was allegedly financed by Castro's government. Rutgers University at Newark, and Rutgers University at Livingston are planning to offer trips to Cuba as a 16 credit study program.

Hunter College of the City of New York has an extreme left dominated Hostos Society directed by an active member of the Venceremos Brigade.

We consider the Venceremos Brigade to be at present Fidel Castro's main instrument of instigation, subversion and communist propaganda on U.S. college campuses. The Venceremos Brigade has been widely proved to be the melting pot of all Extreme Left factions within the United States, as well as the communist-organized utilizer of naive idealism among some American students. Confrontation with ABDALA

1969-Hunter College of the City of New York.-Heated argument with Venceremos Brigade speaker, member also of the Youth Socialist Alliance. 1971-Rutgers, New Brunswick.-Venceremos Brigade showed film "Compañeros y Compañeras" and sought financial contributions. Sponsored by several S. D. S. inspired groups.

1971-Rutgers, Livingston.-Venceremos Brigade showed $4.00 admission to showing of same film after New Brunswick confrontation with ABDALA mem

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