Mr. Chancellor Pitt. Mr. Phipps Sir Elijah Mr. Chancellor Pitt. Mr.Pelham Mr. Chancellor Pitt. Mr. Chancellor Pitt obferved, that if fuch evidence was not fuffered to be taken, it would difarm juftice; and he fhould be ashamed of any Minifter who held a contrary doc trine. Mr. Phipps faid, that whenever Sir Elijah Impey refufed to give evidence, it would then be in fact evidence against himself. He thought public juftice might go on without fuch feverity; and if Sir Elijah Impey was examined, he would not stay in the House, and he would take care not to look at any papers which had his evidence, as he would not be biaffed by fuch evidence, taken from an unprotected King's evidence. It was at length agreed that the Chairman fhould inform Sir Elijah Impey, "that a criminal profecution might be in"ftigated against him for extra-official, and other conduct, "during his refidence in India, and that the circumstances 66 on which he was to be examined, may be connected with "the charges which might be exhibited against him." Sir. Elijah Impey was then called, and the Chairman having given him the above information, Sir Elijah Impey faid, "I thank you, Sir; but being con"fcious of no guilt, and having no part of my conduct which I wish to fecrete, I have no objection to give the "Committee the fulleft information in my power." Mr. Burke then proceeded in the examination; after which, and Mr. Middleton's examination, the House adjourned. Wednefday, 21st February. Mr. Chancellor Pitt gave notice that he would, on the enfuing Monday move for the House to refolve itself into a Committee of the whole Houfe, to take into confideration certain refolutions for the confolidation of the duties on cuftoms, &c. and that he should on that day alfo move, that the refolutions from the Committee on the commercial treaty, lately reported, and agreed to by the Houfe, fhould be referred to the faid Committee. Mr. Pelham defired to know, whether the right honourable gentleman meant to unite the confolidation of duties and the refolutions on the commercial treaty in one bill, or to keep them separate, and make each the fubject of a diftinct bill. Mr. Chancellor Pitt answered, that any member whatfoever muft, like himself, remaim totally at a loss to discover the future nature of the decifion of the Houfe in the matter alluded to by the honourable gentleman; which ever way ap feared to the House most proper to adopt, undoubtedly that muft must be the way followed. In his opinion the uniting the two objects in one bill would be the propereft proceeding, as they were neceffarily relative to each other, and, in fome degree, immediately connected. Mr. Black burnne. Mr. Blackburne remarked, that as the treaty had undergone a confiderable degree of difcuffion, he would not attempt to take up the time of the House, by going into a detail of its merits, but would content himself with observing, that it appeared to him, from the moft ferious attention which he had been able to pay to it, to be likely to become productive of the most beneficial confequences to Great Britain. The bleffings of peace would be rendered more permanent, a circumitance highly fortunate and defirable after fo long and fo unfortunate a war. In the course of the dif cuffions which had taken place upon the fubject in that Houfe, he obferved that great stress had been laid upon the opinion of the manufacturers: He was therefore extremely happy to be able to affure the Houfe from his own knowledge, that the manufacturers of the county which he had the honour to reprefent, not only approved of it, but were exceedingly anxious that the treaty fhould be carried into execution with as little delay as poffible. As a proof, that these were the fentiments of at least a very large defcription of manufacturers, Mr. Blackburne produced an authentic. letter, which he had that day received by the poft from Manchefter, and which, he begged permiffion to read to the Houfe. He accordiugly read the following letter: Manchefter, Feb. 19. "At a fpecial meeting, held here this evening, of the "Committee of Fuftian Manufacturers, "Refolved unanimoufly, that as feveral Refolutions have "been publifhed in the London Papers, by the general "Chamber of Manufacturers of Great Britain, expreffing "doubts relative to the expediency of the treaty of com"merce lately concluded between this kingdom and France, "and a petition figned by fome of the members of the "Chamber having been prefented to the Houfe of Commons, praying Parliament to defer the confideration of the "faid treaty, until the petitioners fhall have time to satisfy "themselves relative to feveral points alluded to in the said "Refolutions and petition, "We, the Committee appointed at a General Meeting of "the Fuftian Manufacturers, for the purpose of corref"ponding with the Lords of the Committee of Council, "refpecting the commercial arrangements between this country and France, think it incumbent on us to declare, "that no perfon has been appointed by us as a Delegate to "the General Chamber of Manufacturers. σε "That after the moft mature deliberation, we are una"nimously of opinion, that the commercial treaty between "Great Britain and France will be highly beneficial to the "cotton manufacturers of this town and neighbourhood, "and we hope and truft, that Parliament will with all pro66 per expedition proceed to render the faid treaty effica❝cious. "By order of the Committee, 66 JOHN KEARSLY, Chairman." Mr. Blackburne now moved an Addrefs in the following words: "That an humble Addrefs be prefented to His Majefty, affuring His Majefty that we had taken into our most serious confideration the provifion contained in the treaty of navigation and commerce, concluded between His Majesty and the Moft Chriftian King; and we beg leave to approach His Majefty with our fincere and grateful acknowledgments for this additional proof of His Majesty's conftant attention to the welfare and happiness of his people. "That we shall proceed with all proper expedition in taking fuch steps as may be neceffary for giving effect to a system fo well calculated to promote beneficial intercourse between Great Britain and France, and to give permanence to the bleffings of peace. "That it is our perfuafion that we cannot more effectually confult the general interefts of our country and the glory of His Majefty's reign, than in concurring in a measure that tends to the extenfion of trade, and the encouragement of industry and manufactures, the genial fources of national wealth, and the fureft foundation of the profperity and happinefs of His Majefty's dominions." Captain The honourable Captain Berkeley remarked that he could Berkeley. not fecond the motion without declaring, in the fame moment, that it gave him fingular fatisfaction to exprefs his hearty and fincere approbation of one of the best, and he would fay, one of the most popular commercial treaties, into which this country had ever entered. The honourable gentleman who made the motion, had produced a copy of a letter ftating in the moft unequivocal terms, the due fenfe which the fuftian manufacturers of Lancashire entertained of the treaty of commerce lately concluded with the Moft Chriftian King; and he had alfo in his hand authentic papers from the manufacturers of a county, not the most inconfiderable for its valuable woollen manufactures, the county which he had the honour to reprefent. The woollen manufacturers of Gloucefterfhire had communicated their fentiments to him upon the fubject, and had requested of him to ftate their entire fatisfaction with the treaty, and their ear neft neft wishes to have it fpeedily carried into execution. Nor was it from the fentiments of the manufacturers of this county alone that he collected his opinion that the treaty held out the moft flattering profpect to Great Britain; he collected it in an equal manner from the manufacturers of France. The manufacturers of the towns of Rouen and Abbeville, two of the greatest woollen manufacturing towns in all France, had affembled and folemnly declared, that if the Parliament of Great Britain approved of the treaty, and carried it into execution, their manufactures must be ruined; fo little able were they to cope with British manufactures, and bear on a competition with them in any market. Having stated this, Mr. Berkeley took notice of the various arguments used to prove an infraction of the Methuen treaty, or that it was done away entirely. He denied that the commercial treaty with France contained any thing which could affect the Methuen treaty, or alter our fituation with Portugal in any degree whatfoever. Now if the fact were true, that it had been faid in another Houfe of Parliament, that Portugal was at that time negociating with France for the latter to monopolize all her Brazil cotton, in that case he Thould contend that Portugal was guilty of an infraction of the treaty, and that we had confequently a right to complain of a breach of faith in Portugal, inftead of Portugal having any cause of complaint to alledge against Great Britain. It was, he believed, cuftomary, on fuch occafions as the prefent, to pay a compliment to the Minifter of the day, and he would avail himself of the ufage, by declaring that he held in his hand a teftimonial of the grateful fense which the manufacturers of Gloucefterfhire entertained of the meritorious conduct of the right honourable gentleman near him, in having made a treaty, in the higheft degree flattering to the manufacturers of Great Britain. This compliment was the more valuable from its fincerity, fince it was well known that the inhabitants of the county of Gloucefter had been adverse to the right honourable gentleman, when he first came into office, but that they now confeffed themselves converts to his spotlefs integrity, and were convinced that he was the heir of his great father's eminent public virtues, and had no object in view but the good of his country. Mr. Grey (member for Northumberland) now remarked Mr. Grey. that it was not without reluctance that he rofe for the first time in this Houfe, to ftand forward in debate upon a measure, which, from the vast variety of interefts it embraced, from the extent of knowledge it comprehended, and, above all, from the total change it muft occafion both in the political and commercial fyftems of this country, may appear to require more ferious argument and more folid information than he he could be fuppofed to poffefs. Fully impreffed with a sense of its magnitude and importance, he had hitherto remained filent during the different ftages of difcuffion through which it had paffed; nor fhould he now have prefumed to trouble the Houfe, but that a circumftance had lately come to his knowledge, which appeared to him to be of the most serious. moment, and which he thought it his duty to disclose to the House, as an additional caution to them to proceed with the greatest circumfpection, and not to preclude themfelves by a premature decifion (for the addrefs now moved appeared to him to be abfolutely decifive) from exercifing at any future period their undifputed right of rejecting, if it fhould appear wife to them to do fo, the treaty that has been laid before them. Before he opened this circumftance, however, he fhould fhortly advert to the arguments ufed by the honourable members who moved and feconded this addrefs. Both of these honourable gentlemen laid great ftrefs on the general acquiefcence of the people; but as the proof of that acquiefcence was founded only on universal stillness throughout the nation, Mr. Grey faid that he must beg leave to object to a negative argument of that fort, as he never could admit that a filence of complaint can be construed into pofitive approbation. Their next argument was derived from the approbation of the manufacturers whom this treaty most immediately affected, and both produced fuch documents from their refpective conftituents as would not give him room to doubt of the fact. However, he must object to this argument alfo, as he fhould at all times to the authority of any men, who, though intrinfically honeft and upright, are, from their fituation, open to the impreffions of perfonal advantage. For his own part, he could have no doubt, but, from the prefent allowed fuperiority of our manufactures to thofe of France, we fhould derive a temporary advantage; and it was this circumstance which ought to make us the more cautious in paying a too implicit belief to the opinions of manufacturers who may have their minds divefted from a confideration of the future confequences of a fyftem which holds out to them a feducing profpect of immediate gain. But, more particularly, muft he object to an admiffion of their opinions at this moment in favour of the treaty of navigation and commerce with France, when he found them directly contradicted by their evidence given upon oath on the subject of the Irish propofitions. And indeed the principles laid down by them at that feafon weighed infinitely more with him than their prefent opinions, when he recollected that they then had fufficient time for mature deliberation, without the influence of prefent intereft to warp their judgement or biafs their understandings. But the right honourable |