[197] took out. Admiral INGLIS. They did not take out anything, Senator Ferguson, I want to make that quite clear. They only suggested that

Senator FERGUSON. Tell us some of the things that they

Senator FERGUSON. All right, what did they suggest that you take out?

Admiral INGLIS. There was one paragraph, for example, that I remember that I had in suggesting that the country as a whole was not unified just before Pearl Harbor.

Senator FERGUSON. Now, who told you that?

Admiral INGLIS. That was my own opinion and, therefore, I agreed that it was not proper to put in the presentation. There were some other items.

Senator FERGUSON. Had you talked over with anyone the fact that you wanted to put that in?

Admiral INGLIS. I talked it over with my staff; yes, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. And who was your staff?

Admiral INGLIS. Captain Davis, Captain Phelan and Commander Hindmarsh and a number of others.

Senator FERGUSON. How did that happen to come into this question of what actually happened at Pearl Harbor? Were you trying to fix responsibility?

[198] Admiral INGLIS. No, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, then, why would you suggest even putting in that the people were not prepared?

Admiral INGLIS. I thought that it might give a little background that would be good for the

Senator FERGUSON. You used the word "united," that the people were not united?

Admiral INGLIS. The people of this country were not united.

Senator FERGUSON. I understand the President said something to that effect about the time that the reports were issued. You did not get the suggestion from that, did you?

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir. I got it from my own understanding of the psychology of this country at that time.

Senator FERGUSON. Of the American people?

Admiral INGLIS. That is right, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, with whom did you discuss that item? Admiral INGLIS. I discussed it with Captain Davis, with Captain Phelan. I am quite sure, with both Mr. Mitchell and Mr. Gesell. Senator FERGUSON. What did they say about it?

Admiral INGLIS. After considerable discussion it was agreed, and I concurred in the decision, that it should be Senator FERGUSON. What was the discussion?

[199]

omitted.

Admiral INGLIS. The discussion was whether or not that was appropriate to put in a factual presentation of this kind.

Senator FERGUSON. What did it have to do with the attack on Pearl Harbor?

Admiral INGLIS. Well, we all agreed

Senator FERGUSON. Do you think the people were to blame?
Admiral INGLIS. Are you asking for my opinion?

Senator FERGUSON. Well, you put it in the memo and they persuaded you to take it out. I am asking you whether that is your opinion?

Admiral INGLIS. My opinion is that they did contribute to some extent to the Pearl Harbor attack.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, you explain how that contributed to the Pearl Harbor attack.

Admiral INGLIS. Because the armed forces were not as strong as they might have been had the country been unified and had the appropriations been larger for the Army and Navy.

Senator FERGUSON. All right; now, do you know anything about the appropriations?

Admiral INGLIS. I only know that the Navy kept asking for more than they could get.

[200] Senator FERGUSON. Did you know this, that when the Navy asked for an item that on many occasions the Budget Director and the Executive branch of the Government cut it down?

Admiral INGLIS. Yes, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. And Congress often put them up?

Admiral INGLIS. I did not know about the latter. I did know about the former.

Senator FERGUSON. Did you know that the people, the Congress for the people, did put those up?

Admiral INGLIS. Now that you mention it I believe very likely that there were certain specific instances where the Congress did increase appropriations.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, how could you blame the people for not getting armament?

Admiral INGLIS. I am not blaming them, Senator. I am just saying that that was my opinion, that that was the frame of mind that this country was in at that time.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, will you furnish to the committee your original drafts where you had that in and I would like to see all the other things that were taken out, and will you now give us the other things that were taken out?

Admiral INGLIS. I will furnish that if I can. I am afraid that was destroyed. Now, the other things that were taken out

[201] Senator FERGUSON. Why would you destroy anything like that afterward?

Admiral INGLIS. I did not see any reason to keep it if it was not to be presented.

Senator FERGUSON. Have you any notes or any memorandum in relation to the preparing of your memo?

Admiral INGLIS. I am not sure, sir. I will have to look through my papers; I am not sure.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, will you furnish to the committee, so that the committee may have them, all your notes and all your memoranda? Admiral INGLIS. I will furnish anything I have.1

Senator FERGUSON. All right; now, what else was taken out? Admiral INGLIS. The other things that were taken out were historical items dating back to 1931.

Senator FERGUSON. What were they?

Admiral INGLIS. An outline of the Japanese aggression in Manchuria, the Marco Polo Bridge incident, of the aggression of Italy toward Ethiopia, of Germany towards Austria, the Saar, and showing

the rise of nazism and fascism.

1 See Hearings, Part 11, p. 5294.

Senator FERGUSON. Will you just take this outline and tell me how many of the items, including the blame on the American people, are included in the request?

[202]

Admiral INGLIS. They are not in the outline and, therefore, they were taken out.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, how did you come to put them in at all? The Navy was not going to make a defense, were they?

Admiral INGLIS. That is why they were taken out, Senator.

Senator FERGUSON. Because the Navy was attempting to make a defense, is that right?

Admiral INGLIS. That was my own personal idea and I soon saw that it was not sound and, therefore, they were taken out.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, did you discuss it with the Judge Advocate?

Admiral INGLIS. I believe I did, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. And he consented to put it in?

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir; no, sir; I was advised by everyone that I talked to that it should come out.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, did you show it to Mr. Mitchell?
Admiral INGLIS. I am not sure whether it was Mr. Mitchell or Mr.
Gesell that I talked to about it.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, did you show them your memo?
Admiral INGLIS. No, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Did you have a memo prepared of that? [203] Admiral INGLIS. I had a rough draft of this material. Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, will you try and look to see whether you have your rough draft?

Admiral INGLIS. Yes, sir; I have already agreed to get anything that I have available.

Senator FERGUSON. Did you talk with Admiral King—

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. (continuing)

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir.

about preparing it?

Senator FERGUSON. The Secretary of the Navy Forrestal?

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir; that was my own idea, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, did you discuss it with anyone?

Admiral INGLIS. I discussed it with the people whom I have already enumerated.

Senator FERGUSON. Where did you get that data?

Admiral INGLIS. From my own recollection of the history of the world from 1931 on.

Senator FERGUSON. What did you think that had to do with the actual physical facts at Pearl Harbor?

Admiral INGLIS. It was only background material that I thought might be of some value.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, on this exhibit, we will call it exhibit 1-Mr. Chairman, I now offer it in evidence.

Mr. MITCHELL. Exhibit 3.

[204]

Senator FERGUSON. What?

Mr. MITCHELL. Exhibit 3.

Senator FERGUSON. I offer Exhibit 3.

(The document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. 3".)

Senator FERGUSON. The first that you saw of this particular exhibit was this morning?

Admiral INGLIS. That is correct, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Have you got your testimony before you? Have you got your page where were referring to the shipping route? Admiral INGLIS. Yes, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Will you read it?

Admiral INGLIS. I quote from the testimony of yesterday.

Senator FERGUSON. Yes.

Admiral INGLIS (reading):

The Chief of Naval Operations on November 25, 1941 directed that all transPacific shipping be routed through the Torres Strait between Australia and New Guinea.

Senator FERGUSON. Now, that is all you said about it?

Admiral INGLIS. That is all I said about it except under cross-examination.

Senator FERGUSON. Yes, and I asked you some questions on cross examination. I asked you to get the original.

[205]

Now I will ask you why you did not put in the part that was to provide for escorts!

Admiral INGLIS. I think that was perhaps omitted by my staff because it might have been somewhat controversial.

Senator FERGUSON. You think that this part of the message is controversial, "Provide necessary escort"?

Admiral INGLIS. It might lead to controversy because of the word "necessary." That would be a difference of opinion as to the disposition of ships for escorts as opposed to the need for keeping them concentrated for combat.

Senator FERGUSON. Now, did any member of this staff, of this committee staff, check your memorandum that you were going to write here prior to its writing?

Admiral INGLIS. No, sir, not the draft. There was some discussion

about it.

Senator FERGUSON. There was some discussion. Did any member read it prior to the time that you gave it here?

Admiral INGLIS. Not to the best of my knowledge.

Senator FERGUSON. Did they ever see the exhibits upon which it was founded?

Admiral INGLIS. Do you mean by "exhibits" these things in the folder or that

Senator FERGUSON. No; I mean such as Exhibit 3.
[206] Admiral INGLIS. I don't know what they saw,

sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Have you any idea whether they ever saw it? Admiral INGLIS. I think that a great many records were available to the counsel.

Senator FERGUSON. What do you mean "available”?
Admiral INGLIS. Were turned over to them.

Senator FERGUSON. Why was this not turned over?

Admiral INGLIS. Perhaps it was.

Senator FERGUSON. I will ask counsel now, when did counsel get this Exhibit 3?

Mr. MITCHELL. I first saw it about 10 minutes ago.

Mr. GESELL. Well, I think, to make the record clear

Senator FERGUSON. That is what we would like to have.

Mr. GESELL. (continuing) There is in the file of counsel a very substantial number of dispatches.

Senator FERGUSON. No, no, let us keep the record clear.

Mr. GESELL. I beg your pardon, Senator. I am answering your question, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. When did you get Exhibit 3?

Mr. GESELL. That particular dispatch is very likely among the group of dispatches which we have had in our office for a considerable period of time. If you are talking about the piece of paper in your hand, we saw that this morning.

[207] Senator FERGUSON. Well, did he make the statement of yesterday based on very likely whether this was in your file or not? The CHAIRMAN. Is there any dispute about the authenticity of this Exhibit No. 3?

Admiral INGLIS. None whatsoever.

The CHAIRMAN. Is there any dispute on the part of any member of the committee?

Senator FERGUSON. Am I to take that that I am not supposed to examine the witness about that?

The CHAIRMAN. Not at all; I just want to know whether there is any dispute about the authenticity of this document that you are talking about.

Senator FERGUSON. The question is why it has not been produced to the committee, that we are on right now.

Will you give me all the information in the Navy in relation to the part of this message that says, "Provide necessary escort?"

Admiral INGLIS. I am authorized to say that the Navy Department-or to say for the Navy Department that any information requested by the committee which is available to the Navy will be produced.

Senator FERGUSON. Well, now, but do you take that request as not from one of the committee?

[208] Admiral INGLIS. No, sir; from the committee as a request which will be complied with to the best of our ability.1

Senator FERGUSON. Have you any information, personal information, on this "Provide necessary escort?"

Admiral INGLIS. I have not, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. Did you know at any time that there was any message including this "Provide necessary escort?"

Admiral INGLIS. The only information that I had was what I gave the committee yesterday, until I saw that message which you have in your hand.

Senator FERGUSON. You gave us a list yesterday of the location of all ships in the Pacific, did you not?

Admiral INGLIS. Yes, sir.

Senator FERGUSON. I will ask you where the Boise was between the 23d of November 1941, and the 6th of December 1941?

Admiral INGLIS. The Boise?

Senator FERGUSON. Yes.

Admiral INGLIS. My recollection is that the Boise was in the Asiatic Fleet.

Senator FERGUSON. Do you know where the American Leader ship

was?

1See memorandum from the Navy Department in Hearings, Part 11, p. 5499.